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Fahrenheit 9/11

Caught Fahrenheit 9/11 last night. Pretty amazing stuff. The most surreal thing was seeing a film like this in the same environment where we normally chow down on popcorn and cheer when Jean Grey shows signs of her inner Phoenix. I'm not educated enough to give you an educated opinion, so I won't try. What I will say is that it's powerful. There are bits that'll come as a complete surprise (and not in a happy way) to many, but even those who've done their part to keep up with the real news will be a little taken aback at seeing it put forth this way. Some reviews I've read point to it as a mere shock piece, citing the images of gruesomely wounded Iraqis and whatnot -- let me tell you, that wouldn't even rank in my top ten in terms of the most assaulting moments. It's bias, yes, but it's the ultimate voicing of a sentiment shared by many, many people. The film's point is to paint Bush as an asshole; if not, some will certainly leave the theater thinking he's a buffoon. Moore makes points of varying validity; some you won't agree with, others will have you embarrassed for having previously believed anything different. Though at times unfairly bias and skewed, some of Moore's gathered factoids and clips simply can't be argued against. If you erase the op parts and just view the purely documentary portion, you're still left with some serious shit to think about. Moore's mission wraps up without a solid smoking gun, but there's more than enough here to sway a flighty opinion.

Posted by Matt on 06/26/2004. E-mail me!



Discussion Thread: 124 comments
1 2 3 … 5

Just to show both sides of the issues…

(check the "homepage")

Chestnuts roasted by None @ 06/26/2004 5:11 PM

Edit: I meant say check my "homepage"…

Chestnuts roasted by None @ 06/26/2004 5:13 PM

Well the thing about Moore you gotta think about (if you did’nt know already) is that he is EXTREMELY biased against Bush, he also thinks every republican to ever exist is as evil as satan and twice as ugly. So I really don’t pay attention to what he says though I havent seen F 9/11, I just don’t think I would be getting a fair oppinion. But it looks like you pretty much paid attention mostley to the factual stuff so you probably got more out of it than some did. Anyway when are you gonna do that Hostess Snack Maker? Or did you give it to RoG at I-Mockery so he and his pal could give it the middle finger? Im just glad I didnt buy it, which I almost did.

Chestnuts roasted by Mr. S @ 06/26/2004 5:14 PM

Well, I know the truths are stretched by clever organization in the film, but really, just seeing the actual footage he’s acquired makes it interesting. The rest is up for debate obviously.

Chestnuts roasted by Matt @ 06/26/2004 5:17 PM

$9.25 for a movie ticket man that is a alot. I feel ripped off if I pay even pay $7.50 at the movies.

Chestnuts roasted by JoseRZ @ 06/26/2004 5:23 PM

Welcome to New Yawk.

Chestnuts roasted by Matt @ 06/26/2004 5:24 PM

matt you should’ve went to matinee 5.75

Chestnuts roasted by Drphilisdadevil @ 06/26/2004 5:28 PM

All I can say is that I know someone who used to work with Michael Moore, and I will say no more about Moore in respect for possible fans of his work here.

This has been on Drudge for the past couple of days and ties in with None’s link for the other side’s opinion:
‘Michael and them: Moore foes hold fest’ http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/thr/article_display.jsp?vnu_content_id=1000552469

Chestnuts roasted by ME @ 06/26/2004 5:36 PM

A political discussion here? Where’s the Ecto-Cooler?

Seriously, there’s no filmmaking laws that say Moore has to be balanced. I’m tired of the conservative mouthbreathers whining about that. There isn’t a documentary made in the HISTORY OF FILM that has total balance. Go ahead, try to find one!

"Balance" is a new term for crybabies who can’t street fight in the political world.

Moore is making a personal political statement. The film has more truth than many want to believe, and yes, it does distort events to make a bigger point. But it’s Moore’s film and his angle on events.

Doesn’t anyone ever wonder why there isn’t a right-wing Moore-ish type of filmmaker?

Chestnuts roasted by Todd Leroy Cummings @ 06/26/2004 5:38 PM

I need to know: for those of you who have seen the film, did the audience clap when the smart old lady wrapped up her speech? Everyone kept waiting for her to be all old and feeble, but she kept churning out the Old Lady Awesomeness one line after another.

Chestnuts roasted by Matt @ 06/26/2004 5:42 PM

You’d be surprised about how little of this movie was not distorted by Moore. This is beyond just Moore’s "angle of events." This is another deliberate attempt at misleading the American public to serve Moore’s and other extreme liberals’ political agendas. I did not vote for Bush, would like him out of office, and am not strongly conservative, but I can just never take anything produced by Moore as anything close to the whole story. Here’s a site that I believe everyone needs to see: http://www.bowlingfortruth.com

Chestnuts roasted by XTacy @ 06/26/2004 5:59 PM

Obviously the guy ain’t bulletproof, far from it. I’m not so much a fan of his, I just agree with a lot of what’s said in F911. I guess the difference is that I believed these things before seeing the movie; for someone with an opinion closer to XTacy’s, I can see why they might be upset. If you look at this film and consider it unbelievably skewed and unfair, you’re going to be pissed off seeing others swap sides based on viewing it.

Regardless, I still agree with the points made. Some of the tactics, maybe not. Some of the corny string-pulling, definitely not. But the really important stuff? Yes.

Chestnuts roasted by Matt @ 06/26/2004 6:06 PM

I read "Stupid White Men" a while back. It was a great book, infuriating, but still a great book. I later found out that some of Moore’s "facts" were skewed or completely made up to make for a more entertaining read. It’s kinda soured my view of him for the moment. I’d still like to see the movie at some point though.

Chestnuts roasted by pulseczar @ 06/26/2004 6:35 PM

Stupid White Men was a great movie. I have yet to see F 9/11 but I’m sure it wil just tell me what I already know. I mean its a given that Bush is a fuck-up but also you almost have to have some sympathy for him. If you were the President how much could you trust your Intellegence agencies? They must get flooded with false threats and other forms of info that aren’t true on a daily basis. I can tell you right now that being the president of this country is the last job i’d EVER want. When you have to make your decisions on what your advisors tell you is right its a huge gamble. I know all of you think I’m full of shit but you gotta find some truth behind what i say.

Chestnuts roasted by phunqsauce @ 06/26/2004 7:22 PM

Todd Leroy Cummings- There are, but they never get any publicity or really any funding for that matter because everybody hates them. Especially religious folk like me.

Chestnuts roasted by Nate @ 06/26/2004 7:29 PM

I have yet to see f9/11 and i cant really say that i plan to. I already dislike bush with a passion and dont feel the need to watch a movie that will piss me off all over again. and yes it is a one sided view of things but people know that going in. all in all atleast it gives people somthing to talk about.weather you like him or hate him you know that there will be healthy discussion

Chestnuts roasted by Anonymous @ 06/26/2004 8:05 PM

I should probably make the correction that I’m not exactly a right-wing conservative, but some people may consider me to be so. I would say that I’m more towards the middle. I should also add that not EVERYBODY hates right-wing conservatives, it just seems that way sometimes.

The truth is, I neither like nor hate bush, and I am really quite indifferent when it comes to politics altogether. I guess you could say I’m more of an anarchist in the fact that I think people should base their actions on their own personal ethics rather than whether it’s legal or not.

Chestnuts roasted by Nate @ 06/26/2004 8:11 PM

Perhaps a Libertarian, Nate?

Chestnuts roasted by Nachokhaki @ 06/26/2004 9:44 PM

"The truth is, I neither like nor hate bush, and I am really quite indifferent when it comes to politics altogether."

Couldnt agree more, politics is generally something I really dont concern myself with most of the time. Bush aint perfect, but what president is/was?

Chestnuts roasted by Mr. S @ 06/26/2004 11:05 PM

Ooooh, I have to wonder where this thread will end up. I guess that first guy’s been Googling "Michael Moore" all day looking for places to plug.

I’ve been waiting for F911 for some time and now I’ve got a fair opinion from someone I trust (and who’s waited to see the movie before judging it).

"Though at times it may seem unfairly bias and skewed, some of Moore’s gathered factoids and clips simply can’t be argued against."

Hey, they’ve got Fox News, we need somebody on our side who isn’t afraid of playing as dirty as them ;)

Chestnuts roasted by squee4242 @ 06/26/2004 11:12 PM

woo-who– first time posting here! I think I’ll do something to celebrate! like drink. done.

Ookay. Moore– first of all, most of what he says in Bowling for Columbine is not even in question. Because the link was given upthread for a partisan attack on Moore, read his response http://www.michaelmoore.com/words/wackoattacko/">here. I think he covers most of what the others claim. People argue about minor points (the gun in the bank scene), but they can’t argue with his major themes, because he is correct. They try and smear the film by smearing the film-maker (see David Brooks in the Times today), and try and discredit the whole film by focusing on one or two increadible (and yet still true) scenes, but they remain the ones who have trouble with reality.

Second: F9/11. If you’ll notice, any partisan attack on it focuses on two or maybe free points– mostly they’re complaining about his depiction of the Saudis flying (domestically) before the flight ban was lifted. Quite honestly, since that’s the main point of contention that partisan hacks have with the movie, you’d think that on the whole, the film is unimpeachable in its depiction of the facts. In fact, everything Moore says in the film has been checked several times by several teams of lawyers and fact checkers, and it all has been verified.

Anyone who attacks this film on a factual basis just wants the facts to be different– the facts may be seen from a different angle, but I’m afraid that facts are facts.

That’s enough of that.

So, this weekend I learned there was a dark-wing duck movie. I’m so mad that I missed it. Damn.

Chestnuts roasted by syrup @ 06/26/2004 11:23 PM

I didn’t get any cheers for the old lady’s speech, but being in St. Louis, a pretty democratic city, the theater erupted in laughter and applause at the mention of John Ashcroft’s loss to Mel Carnahan — after Carnahan was dead.

Chestnuts roasted by John @ 06/27/2004 12:03 PM

Matt – saw the film and there was some clapping for the awesomeness of the Old Lady at my theatre! I thought the film was good and thought provoking. Moore, of course, is bias toward Dubya, but he makes it easier for more (no pun intended) to see that GW is an asshole! All this shit started from Daddy’s war and now trickles down to weapons of mass destruction and such – Christ’s sakes, I just wish there woulda been some sort of weapon of destruction so it wouldn’t have looked like we went in there for a waste. Now even I’ve got friends dying and fighting over there. Sorry for the rant, but I hate Dubya a lot.

~Say, Say, Say What You Want,
But Don’t Play Games With My Affection.
Take, Take, Take What You Need,
But Don’t Leave Me With No Direction.

Chestnuts roasted by Mugzy. . . @ 06/27/2004 1:13 AM

I saw it last night (Friday) and all the shows were sold out. I live in a pretty liberal city, and people outside were handing out flyers to a peace march in Detroit (I live in a ‘burb). It was fun.

But anyways. About the movie.

It probably was the most powerful movie I have ever seen. Everyone is saying how against conservatives Moore is, but he actually doesn’t really care too much for democrats either. Moore was on a bunch of talk shows on Friday and whenever anyone commented on his bias he fairly admitted that the movie was, while also stating that it was about time that the other side was told compared to something like Fox news.

It was great. I laughed many times, I cried many times, and overall I honestly didn’t think it was as "opininated" as Bowling for Columbine, if that makes any sense. All the evidence was there, he was just the voice to explain the links. If I would’ve seen all that evidence on any news program with Tom Brokaw or something it would have made me just as angry. All of it was put there for everyone to see.

Even if I was a conservative, I would see it just because I believe that it’s always good to hear both sides of a story. Some conservative filmmakers are in the process of making a film to counter Michael Moore, and I’ll probably see that too, just for laughs.

The soldier’s mom still gets to me though.

Chestnuts roasted by Emmaaaaa @ 06/27/2004 2:03 AM

I haven’t seen the movie, so I’d like to reserve judgement on that. However, I do put Michael Moore in the same category as any conservative commentator. Instead of skewing facts I like my information as unbiased as possible because I like to think I can make up my own mind about who I vote for, but I guess listening to conservative talk radio, or reading an Al Fraken book is just easier for most people.

Chestnuts roasted by Mark @ 06/27/2004 2:14 AM

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